Politician dies on 14er; Sewage leaks into river; Top roadside attractions; Historical maps of CO; & More

[00:00:06] Welcome to another episode of the OutThere Colorado Podcast. Once again, I'm Spencer here with Seth. Hello, Spencer. Hello, Seth. Hello. We got Tim over there on the audio and the video for today. Once again, a lot of Colorado topics, but first, Seth, as is tradition. Weekend update. Yeah, how was your weekend? Pretty low key, man. Went to a housewarming party up in them thar hills on Saturday. Where are them thar hills? In thar hills of Florissant. Ooh. Which is how I kept hearing it pronounced at this.

[00:00:36] The party of neighbors, Florissant. I think that's the way I've said it. Yeah. Yeah. All right. You hear Florissant. Florissant. Yeah. Florissant. Yeah. Beautiful. Yeah, that occupied a good portion of the day. Saturday, Sunday, did some hiking. Where'd you go? Actually up around the new portion of Blodgett Open Space on the north side here of Colorado Springs, which is much more synonymous for mountain biking.

[00:01:04] Mm-hmm. A great mountain bike trails up by that old quarry that we've talked about on this show before. Yeah. But I was kind of also curious just kind of about some trail running potential that's kind of opened up with this new stretch of Chamberlain Trail. Yeah, yeah. Along there, getting into the new open space systems. Yeah, just really great expanding opportunities. If you're here in Colorado Springs, there's really good stuff happening on the side of town. Even on that southern side of the Denver metro, too. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Blodgett's a beautiful area. Yeah, yeah. Flip drive.

[00:01:30] You know, one of the more recognizable peaks in town, that very pointy, craggy peak looming over the north side. And there's a lot of good new trails that have been opening up there and continue to open up there. I've heard the mountain bike in there is pretty technical. Yeah, there's a lot of buzz about these new mountain bike only trails. Kind of a, you know, I mean, like we've talked about, these downhill mountain bike only trails are new to Colorado Springs.

[00:01:53] But this new sort of arrangement where you can really session stuff and have different lines just all centered on pretty much this one mountain side. Yeah, yeah. It's pretty unique in town. And, you know, fairly unique in the front range, an amenity like this. Yeah. Yeah, it's on people's radars for sure. I've heard only good stuff. But the one caveat being that it is technical. So make sure you're ready for that. Yeah. But there's some more friendlier lines. Yeah. I was surprised.

[00:02:21] Like, I saw parents with their kids. Really? Mountain biking? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Nice. Yep. Well, I mean, those are Colorado kids though. I know. So there's a caveat there. These kids don't mess around. They use that low center of gravity. They're rated. There's trails rated blue anyway, green and blue. But yeah, there's also some gnarlier stuff. Cool. Yeah. So how about you, man? Busy weekend it sounds like for you. Yeah. Busy weekend, man. You know it's serious when you shed the flannel as you just did. Yeah. The flannel is off. Yeah. I still have a short.

[00:02:49] For listeners only, I am still wearing a shirt. But the flannel is off. Yeah. I forgot not everyone watches on video. Spencer's no longer wearing a shirt. Yeah. He's got a t-shirt on. Dude, kicked it off kind of on Thursday, we'll say. A long time ago, I bought some tickets to the My Chemical Romance show at Coors Field. Yeah, yeah. Bought the tickets. They're like 50 bucks a piece. It was like a bucket list band from high school me, essentially. Yep.

[00:03:17] And I was literally, Tim saw me trying to sell the tickets the day of the show. I was like, do I really want to go up there? Because I just got it back from being abroad and everything. I was tired. I couldn't figure out how to sell the tickets. So I ended up going. Ended up being one of the best shows I've ever seen in my life. Awesome, dude. Crowd participation was off the charts. For those who know My Chemical Romance, they started out doing the whole Black Parade album from start to finish. Oh. Everyone singing like every word to the song. It was wild. I think I saw some videos. Yeah.

[00:03:46] We were in the very top section of Coors Field. But yeah, they put on a great show. And it made me want to go back to Coors Field for additional shows in the future. So I was pretty stoked about that. Yeah. Then Friday, typical work day. You know, typical coverage there. Friday night, popped over to hang out with some family at a girlfriend's family at Redleg. That was nice. What day was that? Friday night.

[00:04:16] Oh, gotcha. Yeah. Then Saturday, dude. It was another jam-packed day. Hiked quite a bit of bar trail. Had to peel off for the sake of time. Got some running in there as well. Then we went to Night Ramen for the first time for a friend's birthday. Dude, it was very good. Okay. Very good. I'm thinking about it for an anniversary. Yeah. It's a good anniversary spot. Definitely a little pricey, right? Yeah. It is kind of like finer dining in Colorado Springs, we'll say. Much more than ramen. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:04:46] Yeah. They have some noodle options. They're appetizers. They have a big set of appetizers. I've heard people just go for appetizers. Yeah. Yeah. Or small plates, as they call them. Yeah. Got some good cocktails as well. Yeah, man. I was really impressed. But yeah. I'll probably save it for a special occasion. A special occasion. I mean, I think my ramen bowl and I got the beef short rib one, which was like the more expensive one. I think it was 25 bucks. So not like pepper tree level of pricey-ness.

[00:05:13] But you're spending at least 20, 25 bucks for an entree. But yeah, very good. Some of the best ramen I've had in Colorado, for sure. If not the best. I was impressed. So I'll be back. I'm very curious about the trend of ramen. Yeah. In finer dining. Yeah. I mean, it's... How did we go from our college dorm rooms of eating ramen to being in these upscale places of eating ramen?

[00:05:40] You know, I think it's like any type of food where there's levels, right? Like you're definitely not... There's levels to this? Yeah. You're definitely not eating like dorm room ramen in these bowls. No doubt. No doubt. I know. And I mean, mine had like giant chunks of beef in there. Like it was very good. Had the little egg and everything. Yeah. Yeah. It was delicious. Now that I'm talking about it more, I might be like, you know what? Maybe there's more of like a monthly switch. Especially in the colder months, you know? Yeah. That's what it'd be perfect for. We sat outside in the heat eating the ramen and it was still delicious.

[00:06:09] So there's indoor seating and outdoor seating. Cool. The inside looks really cool. They have all the like hanging lanterns on the ceiling. Very cool spot. Glad I finally got to check that out. Yeah. On Sunday, took the dirt bike after doing some chores. Well, we did a ton of chores. Then took the dirt bike up Rampart Range Road a little bit. Soaked in some of those views. And then went up through North Cheyenne Canyon. And that was fun as well. Then went golfing. My gosh, dude. And then after that, went to the fifth anniversary party for OCC Brewing.

[00:06:39] Wow. Had a delicious burger. You got some stamina. Yeah, man. You got some stamina. Oh, dude. I was asleep at like 9, 9.30 every night. And then I'm still tired right now. But anyway, a very good weekend in Colorado Springs. Sounds like. And a very good concert at Coors. Good on you. Yeah, let's get into some of these topics, though. We'll start with one that's pretty nasty, to be honest. I think I know where this is going. Yeah.

[00:07:08] Did you hear that 4.2 million gallons of untreated sewage? Sure did. Somehow accidentally made its way out of the Pueblo water treatment plant into the Arkansas River. Sure did hear about this. Yeah, Colorado Parks and Wildlife warning people of avoiding Arkansas River downstream of Pueblo. One state park in particular is going to be impacted. John Martin Reservoir State Park. Getting out east there. Yeah, out there by Los Animas.

[00:07:39] Basically, all this sewage that has been released into the water is expected to hit the reservoir at that state park today. We're recording on Monday. No clue when that'll get better at this time. They're going to be doing regular testing. Apparently, the E. coli levels are high, and that's the issue. I mean, that's just nasty, regardless of how to. Yeah. E. coli levels are not, you know.

[00:08:06] But, yeah, so people have been asked to avoid all contact with that water for the time being, including swimming, wading, tubing, paddleboarding, fishing, and all other activities. Keep your pets out of it as well. The park is still open. The state park remains open to visitors. So there's some other stuff you can do there in the area. But just stay out of the water because there cannot emphasize enough. 4.2 million gallons of wastewater from Pueblo making its way south. So something worth noting.

[00:08:36] Sounds like a pretty nasty, nasty situation. There are also some cyanobacteria concerns at the park. Recently, that has been downgraded from the red tier to the yellow tier, which is still like an advisory. Lake Hasty is also really close to John Martin Reservoir State Park. Not going to be impacted by the sewage spill, but that one is still at red risk when it comes to cyanobacteria. So there you go. That's the disgusting update.

[00:09:05] It's not like we're recording at the lunch hour. Yeah. Yeah. The spill happened between August 26th and August 27th, as far as I could tell. So pretty gross stuff. Let's talk about some fat marmots, though. Hmm. Ready to make a big unveil? A big one. The great fat marmot week. Mm-hmm. The inaugural fat marmot week comes to an end after much fanfare. Wow. What a success this thing was, right? Mm-hmm.

[00:09:35] Springing off fat bear week. The gothic-based right there in Crested Butte, outside Crested Butte, starts this fat marmot week, springing off their marmot project, their long-going research project there. And it's an astounding success by all accounts. All leading to the big winner here. That's what you asked about. Sorry. Daring the lead. The winner is Don, coming in at 13 pounds. Oh, my God. Good job, Don.

[00:10:06] See? Chunkiest of all marmots. Let's see. I think it's from the USA Today report here, but enjoys the taste of rocks. Yep. And taking care of his pups, I heard, and chasing after his ladies, taking care of his ladies. Marmots, if you didn't know. Similarly to elk, as you might be more familiar with, form something like these harems, right? There's groups of females that they mate with. Don does the same. In that regard.

[00:10:35] And stays busy while packing on the weight. So good for Don. I kind of thought Don was a female by the name. Yeah, by male. Yeah. A father marmot. For people who really followed along, these names came from the markings on the fur that researchers have used over the years. The names are inspired by whatever those markings look like. And it just so happens Don is a male with that name. Yeah. He overcame G in the championship here.

[00:11:05] There we go. So Don is the chunkiest of the marmots, of this eight-field bracket-style voting that commenced throughout the week. Like 23,000 plus votes, man. Dang. And media. You mentioned USA Today. I mean, media went off on this all around the country. Added four pounds of weight, I'm seeing, from your reporting on the Gazette. About four pounds of weight. Yep. Yep. Regurgitating Seth's reporting once again. Yep. Yep. So yeah. And I don't know. I kind of wrote, as you alluded to, the story I did.

[00:11:35] Yeah. We top it off with the winner. But I was more curious, like a lot of people, I hope, anyway, that got more interested in marmots, right? That was the whole mission behind this, right? Of the aforementioned Rocky Mountain Biological Lab, which, since 1962, has been studying marmots there in those mountains around Crested Butte and learning all sorts of stuff about the way

[00:11:59] marmots live and survive and socialize and eat and eat and eat and eat before hibernating. What are they eating? What are they eating? They're eating flowers. They're eating grasses. They're eating forbs. They're known to sometimes, like, from their mass that they emerge from to this time of year before heading on into their burrows, they can, like, double or even triple up their weight throughout the summer. Dang.

[00:12:29] To get to this, to get to a very chonky state that we saw them in. I like it. I learned a lot, man. I mean, just how social they are, right? I mentioned they'll eat flowers, right? Like, they've observed, people will love this little anecdote. They've observed males, males get up first and go to female burrows and will, like, literally, like, dig them out and get them up, you know. For after hibernation. Wakey, wakey. After hibernation. After hibernation, yeah. When the snow is melting, they'll, like, start digging them out.

[00:12:58] They observed one male, one bachelor, like, holding a flower beside a burrow, you know, waiting. How romantic. Waiting in the snow. Yeah. Survival is really difficult. The Marmot Project, again, over these years, over these six decades, they've tracked about 50% of pups dying before their first birthday. Wow. So. 60%? 50. 50%. Wow. About 50% of pups dying before their first birthday.

[00:13:27] And, you know, yeah, they've got to, they've got to feast enough to survive that sometimes eight month long hibernation underground. That's, they're living off the fat that they stored, right? And in a winter, like we saw this past winter, where that snow is lacking. I think you mentioned it on the last show. They kind of count on that snow as like an insulating blanket, more or less. Yeah. And when that's not there, they've got to use more energy to get warm. They've got to burn more fat. They, they tracked the researchers this year.

[00:13:57] I talked to a team lead there who put it like going into the season, they lost like a hundred out of like 160 animals that they, that they've tracked. Yeah. So it was a big loss. Last week we were talking about it. I think it was the second largest die off they've observed. Yeah. Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. You know, so at the same time I was told like a winter like this also kind of demonstrates like how super resilient marmots are. Right. So like there's trade-offs that kind of come up, come with a winter that never was like

[00:14:27] this, you know, for as tough as it is to survive without that insulating snow, so to speak, it does mean that the snow melts earlier so they can theoretically get up earlier, have more time to eat, have more time to feast. Right. At the same time, they're exposed longer to predators. They have predators on land and sky, you know, from foxes to badgers to coyotes to raptors. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[00:14:56] So it speaks for itself of how tough it is to evade predation a lot of times. But yeah, nonetheless, like the Marmot Project found some marmots weighing like in early August what they would normally expect them to weigh like in early September, you know. So, you know, there was some success in eating up. And then, yeah, more about socially. I found that really interesting.

[00:15:21] Like I'll just quote a synopsis straight up, you know, while many animals, including primates and some other marmot species depend on living in groups to survive or raise their young, yellow-bellied marmots can thrive alone or in groups of more than 20 marmots. You know, they're kind of, they're versatile in that way. You know, they can be loners or they can be social and have a chance at survival. I thought that was kind of interesting.

[00:15:47] I think I said it last week, and I don't see it in your report here, but a group of marmots called them madness. Are you sure? That's what you're in colony. Colony, it says colony or madness. I think madness is more fun. I'd rather go with madness for sure. A madness of marmots. That's according to the source I have here is Mount Rainier National Park. So, madness of marmots. That's so cool. Yeah. They don't, so they're water? They get water from what they eat, from flowers.

[00:16:17] Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. I would have never guessed that. Yeah. That makes sense. Why not just get water from streams, you know? Yeah. Some predators get water from blood, right? Yeah. Like, yeah. Yep. So, yeah. I mean, like I said, man, I think kind of the hope of these researchers was to get people to turn their attention to this long-going marmot project. Here again, I think you mentioned it. They know it as the world's second longest running study of individually marked mammals behind only.

[00:16:47] Jane Goodall's famous chimpanzee research. Yeah. Who would have guessed right here in Colorado that's going on on these very charismatic alpine dwellers? And something tells me we're going to keep talking about fat marmot week in the years to come. I hope so, man. I like it. I like it. They need to do next year. What's that? Meerkat Manor show. Have you seen that? It's like a, I think it was on like Animal Planet or something.

[00:17:12] But they track the meerkats like it's a drama series where it's like they do the voiceover and there's all this drama unfolding between this meerkat family and meerkat colony. They need to do something like that. I want to watch a documentary series where I can watch the moment with the flowers showing up with the name and have the whole commentary. And they, you know, the mothers will definitely look after their young.

[00:17:38] And I was told sometimes even we'll get in the way of a predator between, you know, between her young and a predator. Other moms, it sounds like help out, you know. Very cool. Mommy clubs, soccer moms up in the high alpine. These marmots. I like it. I like it. Kind of cool, man. Very cool. Yeah. I like this quote too from Adler, which team lead. Katie Adler. Katie Adler. Over there at the lab. Where she says, what is it?

[00:18:07] I'm not lost, of course, but we're not so different from marmots. Exactly. Yeah. Some of us are even chunky like marmots. Yeah. I'm putting on some weight for winter. That's for sure. Adler says she had a couple she was rooting for, but was rooting for them all. Yeah. Rooting for them all. I think also as she put it to me, like they should all be the fattest marmots. Yes. We can only hope that they are all fat and happy. There we go. Man, have you seen this stuff that's going on in Grand Canyon?

[00:18:37] Yeah. With the flooding. Was it like 20 missing or something like that? So the report that I read this morning. So for those of you unfamiliar, so on, I want to say it was August 29th, some major flash flooding happened in the Grand Canyon area, in the area of Bright Angel Creek, in that corridor, hitting kind of that lower, was it Kebab Trail? Kebab Trail. Okay. Yeah.

[00:19:03] But it's one of the trails that goes down to the bottom of the Grand Canyon, as far as I'm understanding. Also hitting the Phantom Ranch area, people staying at the Bright Angel Campground. So an area where people are at in this canyon. I saw something where they had rescued 60-something people. But yeah, two people have been found deceased, 15 people missing or unaccounted for. Yeah, I mean, it's a very tragic situation that's just unfolding.

[00:19:32] But I wanted to mention that because it is some major outdoor recreation news. I mean, one of the worst national park disasters we've ever seen, maybe ever. Like maybe it might be, depending on what ends up happening here, it might be one of the deadliest. Yeah, it sounds like something historically going on, for sure. Yeah, something to follow along with. And yeah, hearts go out to all those people impacted by that.

[00:20:02] In another piece of news, that's not on news, obviously. But did you see that a local politician died on Quandary Peak? Yeah. On August 28th, the Summit County Sheriff's Office responded to a report that a hiker had passed out and wasn't breathing on the lower slopes of Quandary. And Quandary is 14,272 feet tall. So it sounds like on the lower slopes of that, life-saving measures were attempted. They were ultimately unsuccessful.

[00:20:31] The hiker was later identified as Mayor Pro Tem of Inglewood, Joe Anderson, 45 years old. So it sounds like he was a very influential person locally. Did a lot of work with trying to find solutions to homelessness, creating affordable housing, developing infrastructure, improving bicycle and pedestrian safety. So definitely being mourned in that local community. I think they didn't really say anything about what his cause of death was.

[00:21:01] Sounds like it was some sort of a medical event. And I mean, you know, it's a good, you know, obviously a very tragic situation, but a good chance to kind of address what some of those signs of potential medical distress are when you're hiking, I think. It's important to remember in Colorado, you're dealing with both the increased elevation, which can tend to kind of amplify a lot of these medical concerns, puts more stress on the body. Right.

[00:21:29] And then you're also dealing with, especially during summer months, this extreme heat that can dehydrate people rapidly. So those first signs that you're going to want to be looking out for general tiredness and exhaustion, headaches, nausea, shortness of breath, chills, the inability to sweat properly is a big one when it comes to just like what are early signs of dehydration and hitting that wall. And just an early sign of overexertion.

[00:21:55] If any of those symptoms are noticed, the best thing to do is to just stop where you're at and take a second to try to recover, preferably somewhere that's shaded out of the heat during the summer months. Consume water, try to get some calories, maybe some sugar if you can, and really try to let your body have a chance to regulate itself. We were chatting with Dr. Rob Scanlon a few weeks ago about his book related to the five essential hiker safety tips.

[00:22:24] And one of the big things that he was saying was when you start to experience some of these signs of medical distress, it often means that you might be traveling too fast. And I'm not saying that's what happened with this recent death by any means, but slowing down can be a big thing. Your body is often letting you know that you're maybe going too fast, you're overworking yourself.

[00:22:50] If those symptoms don't subside after taking this break, call for help or try to work your way back down the mountain. But if you can't do that, don't hesitate to call for help. That's what Search and Rescue is here for. Therefore, they would much rather respond to any sort of situation sooner rather than later. Things tend to get worse. So I wanted to address that because it is some major news that relates to one of the state's 14ers.

[00:23:17] And yeah, I mean, condolences go out to Mayor Pro Tem Joe Anderson's loved ones and friends and family in that entire town while they're mourning this loss. So it sounds like he was a lot of people in the press release sent out by the town. Describing him as someone who was a good neighbor. Always willing to lend a helping hand and just sounds like a good friend. So I wanted to touch on that briefly here. Yep. Let's get into some of this mapping stuff, though. So I know you're really excited about this.

[00:23:47] I'm really excited about this. I hope we're not the only one. I've mentioned it before, man. I have a map from, it's like a Conoco map from like 1939 or so. I forgot about this. And it shows what Colorado looked like in 1939. And I find it absolutely fascinating. Like you've got like, you know, no I-70 and just all sorts of little differences. The closer you look, you just start to notice things. And you've got a book right here in front of you that has maps that are much, much older than 1939.

[00:24:16] Much, much older. Yeah. Tell us about this. It's a nice book. It's a good looking book. For those not on video. It's a coffee table sized book called The Mapping of Colorado from Indigena to Statehood. It's by P.J. Anderson, who's a historical nut. I think I can call him that here out of Colorado Springs.

[00:24:38] And he just kind of started getting this question on his mind, being familiar as he was with Pike's expedition, most certainly in early 1800s. And also to an extent, Fremont's expedition and Long's expedition. And he got to thinking like, these guys were coming on some kind of information, maybe probably on some kind of map.

[00:25:07] What did those maps look like? What were the earliest maps of Colorado? And what did they show? In other words, what was this picture of Colorado before there was any picture? When there was really just imagination, more or less. Right. So I thought, curiously.

[00:25:28] And so Anderson went near and far trying to dig up all these old maps, centuries old maps, hundreds of years old before statehood here in 1876. Right. And hence why the book is so big. Right. That's kind of the big purpose to show these maps, these old maps in high resolution form altogether. Like they've really never been presented before. So, yeah.

[00:25:58] People like you and me are going to geek out over this. Oh, yeah. I already am. I hopped up whenever we were starting to, before we started the show, I hopped up to check it out. There's going to be some listeners who are probably similarly geeking out and maybe others who I'm about to lull to sleep maybe. I don't know. But so, yeah. To that question of what was the earliest map? The author points to what he describes as the earliest map of Colorado drawn by firsthand observation.

[00:26:28] And that was 1777 by a cartographer, by a Spanish cartographer by the name of Miera. This was during the Dominguez Escalante expedition where this map emerged out of. And so this is just one of several maps from even from 1700s and even before.

[00:26:50] I mean, going back to like 1500s, 1600s when there was these very vague indications of quote unquote parts unknown where you might picture Colorado would be on these North American maps. Or high peaks, quote unquote, in these blank spaces where you might imagine Colorado would be north of a place called New Mexico.

[00:27:14] And west of a place called New France, north of a place as it emerged on. Oh, what map was this that I kind of geeked out over? Tejas was mentioned, right? Way down south. So, yeah. And, you know, like it's also interesting, like a lot of these maps as they came later, like in the 1800s,

[00:27:42] like a lot of them showed like pikes, which I think the namesake he had referred to it as the highest peak, right? The insurmountable highest peak that Pike himself dismissed as as at no one. No one could climb that. There's no way. And later on, Longs came across the Northeast Plains and described those planes as, quote unquote, wholly unfit for cultivation. There's just no way that anyone could ranch on these planes, right?

[00:28:08] I mean, the planes of Colorado that are defined by agriculture, right? So, I mean, and even later, like getting toward the Hayden surveys that show the triangulation where these men, bearded men out of universities around the country came and got to the top of these 14ers and judged from the stars in different angles.

[00:28:33] And on the map, you see these crisscrossing lines trying to determine distances between all these points. And as P.J. Anderson told it, you know, as he put it to me, it's just mind boggling to think of that. Like, what was that like getting up these 14ers and using whatever tools you had to try to measure these distances across the state? So, Hayden's triangulation map came out in, I want to say, 1877. Yes. Wow.

[00:29:03] 1877. So, they're climbing those peaks back then doing that. Yeah. That's wild. Just look at those photos of their cotton attire and their heavy equipment, you know? With no trail to go up. Yeah. People always forget about that. Like, back in the day, it's like nowadays, some of the 14ers are, you know, relatively easy to climb compared to other ones, but it's because of the trail. Yeah. Yeah. And imagine with no trail, no sense of direction, like you're getting cliffed out potentially.

[00:29:30] And a lot of those trails came from the mining era, which is coming long after these expeditions. Yeah. When these miners and their animals were carving trails up to these peaks, some of which we still hike today. Yeah. You know? But yeah, just like the big idea of this book being what was the picture of Colorado when there was no picture? You know, long before the Lewis and Clark expedition.

[00:29:55] Long before Thomas Jefferson spoke of, you know, we shall delineate with correctness the great arteries of this great country. Those who come after us will flip up, will fill up the canvas we begin. You know, like that era, I find very fascinating of when Colorado was really just this blank space on the map that was, you know, this forbidden place that shall not be crossed.

[00:30:23] Only known being these high peaks that march across that landscape, you know? And it was, you know, even going back, you know, it's a state largely influenced, obviously, by Spanish exploration and by French exploration. And we kind of forget about that when we think of big names like Pike, like Longs, like Fremont, right? Before then.

[00:30:47] But really it was people centuries before who were starting to put lines on the map, you know? And largely based, it has to be said, on indigenous knowledge, right?

[00:31:00] It never ceases to amaze me that these highways we drive today, parts of them are based on old railroad routes that were based on old trail routes that indigenous people knew to be the best route through these mountains. And today we go on highways and forget about how that knowledge came in the first place from people on the ground who got to know the ground better than anyone else, right?

[00:31:30] So the book is kind of an ode to that, that still fairly mysterious era. Yeah. By looking at maps, we only get a little bit of a better picture of just what that time must have been like. So cool to see them all collected in that one spot too. Yeah. The San Luis Valley is one spot where like, I think those were old trade routes that existed for hundreds of years kind of through that area, if I remember correctly. But yeah, dude, that's amazing, man. Can people buy this book? Glad you asked it.

[00:31:58] So they're starting off with this pretty exclusive print run. There's like 200 of these books that I'm, that I feel very fortunate to have right here. If you want to go looking for it, my understanding is you might want to check with Hooked on Books here in Colorado Springs. You can check with the History Colorado Center in Denver might have some copies. You can go to PJAnderson.com. I think that's his website, the author's website, PJ Anderson's website, where you might be able to snag a copy too.

[00:32:27] 150 bucks for this big coffee table size book. It's a good looking book. With some beautiful maps that you surely never seen before. I mean, this, this work took him to the Library of Congress, to the back rooms of the Library of Congress, you know, and getting to, I think that's so cool. That's so cool. Again, maybe it's just me and you, man. How long did it take him to compile it? A couple years. A couple years. He's a retired guy. Spent a couple years putting this all together.

[00:32:54] And yeah, like I said, he wrote about Cheyenne Mountain some time ago and the history of that storied mountain. And it was really digging through those journals of Pike where he got to thinking, well, what, what is Pike following? Right. In the early 1800s, what's he going off of? You know, because yeah, there was knowledge that was steadily built hundreds of years before. Very cool. Yeah. Well, that's awesome. I need to, I need to check that book out more. Kind of cool, man.

[00:33:24] Got to go check it out. Cool stuff. So kind of as we get into the tail end of the show, Seth and I tried something last week. This is fun. I think we should try it again. We're basically, our producer, Tim, over from the booth will give us, it's a trend called blind rankings, right? Where whatever the topic might be, for example, the topic might be pizza toppings.

[00:33:50] And then we'll blindly rank the toppings from order one to 10. The catch, though, is that maybe pepperoni is listed as five when I might say that, or maybe it's the first thing that's listed. We might put it at five in case something better comes along when really it might be that one by the end of the, by the end of the ranking. So think about how much you left pepperoni. So without further ado, let's, let's do a blind ranking of some of Colorado's most famous roadside attractions. Okay.

[00:34:20] And so to be clear, I'm ranking some numbers here. You're ranking one through 10. Got it. We're both going to kind of talk about it and come up with our ranking one through 10. Okay. We have no clue what's coming next though. Right. So, uh, Tim, what's a good first one? All right. Mays Natural History Museum. Located in Colorado Springs. Is, um, known for being one of the largest privately, uh, owned collections of bugs in the world.

[00:34:50] Some exotic bugs that you had no idea existed that were only in your nightmares. Yeah. Marked by a giant beetle kind of on that way between Colorado Springs and Canyon City. We're talking like arm sized centipedes, man. Yeah. I think he traveled the world collecting them too, right? Yeah. Um, so yeah, where, where's funky? Okay. How's that rank? One through 10. It's a, it's pretty niche, man. Mm-hmm. You know? With bugs? Yeah. Creepy crawlers? Ah, no offense to it.

[00:35:19] I do, I do think it's really cool. And I'm a big fan of the family over there. Really great people running that museum. And you should go check it out, especially if you've got kids. Mm-hmm. But, um, this is a state of great tourist attractions. Mm-hmm. That are not quite as creepy. I don't, I feel like it might be eight. Eight? What do you think? Uh, yeah, I think I'm comfortable with an eight. Like, like I, like you said, to echo that, very cool. Yeah. Um, I'm curious what we've got coming up next.

[00:35:49] I'm, I'm happy with an eight. And, and to be clear too, um, all of these roadside attractions, uh, are probably worth visiting. So, yeah. Um, yeah, I'll go, I'll go eight. I'll go eight. All right. Ooh. All right. Colorado Gators Reptile Park. You've had big times at the reptile. I have. Yeah. I went there when you could wrestle the alligators and I did that, but I don't think you're able to wrestle them anymore. Uh, at least I don't think they have that same class. I wonder what.

[00:36:19] Um, uh, I mean, that's another one though. I mean, it's, it's shocking that it is in Colorado. Like there's hundreds of alligators just chilling in these like hot spring pools out in the San Luis Valley, uh, near, near Mosca. Mosca. Yeah. Um, I mean, it's cool. It's cool. It's a weird attraction. There's nowhere else in Colorado where you can go see gators. Nowhere else in the country where you can get like maybe outside of Florida. I mean, other places have the, the gator parks and stuff, but I think at the time it was the only place you could wrestle.

[00:36:49] Like just a average person could go in and pay a hundred bucks and wrestle an alligator. Yeah. So, I mean, they did lose that, I think from my understanding. Yeah. Um, I'm good. I'm good by that. Yeah. I did see they were eyeballing a potential expansion maybe up into like Canyon city area. How about that? A dinosaur spot that is no longer there, but, um, follow up on that to see how that's going or if that's happened. So, but, uh, it's pretty remote. I don't know if that matters. What do you think?

[00:37:18] Man, I would give it either a six or a seven. We're, we're right around there. I was thinking that five to seven range. Yeah. Want to go in the middle at six? Yeah. Let's go six. Yeah. Six for Gator Park. All right. So we've got the, the bug museum at eight. We've got Gator Park at six. I'm tracking it. Yeah. We're not, to be clear too, this list won't have like, here's a peak or a something. These are true roadside attractions. Roadside attractions. Yeah. Not so natural. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:37:47] Cano's Castle down in, um, Antonito. Am I correct? Yeah. Yeah. I don't think I've actually seen Cano's castle. So the big thing with me with Cano's castle. Um, so it's, it's essentially this, like this castle looking building that's made out of like beer bottles and hubcaps and all sorts of crazy stuff. It's, it's a one man project. Yeah. Um, very cool looking, like it is very tall. Like it's, you know, it looks like it's at least like four stories tall or something. Yeah.

[00:38:16] The big thing there for me, as far as a roadside attraction goes, you're essentially sitting there and taking a photo from the outside. You can't tour it. And we, you and I both know that there are some serious castles. There are some serious castles. One namely Bishop castle that we're going to hear about. I got to think here. Yeah. Fingers crossed. But, um, um, so you have seen it, uh, down in Antonito. Yeah. I think that you can't, yeah. Drive, drive and buy. That's all you can do. Um, I think that because you can't tour it, that's going to put it in that nine or 10 ranking for me.

[00:38:46] I'm right there with you. Um, I might even go 10 just because you can't tour it. Okay. Sorry, Mr. Candle. Yeah. Or maybe no, you know what? Nine. He still put a lot of hard work into that. So we'll go nine. Right. Yeah. I'm going with you. I, like I said, I haven't seen it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, you can see it and that's, you know, really it. I want to do a story once and this was years ago and I was told, told like in trying to contact him, I was told you got to just come to town and hope to see him riding his bike around. Yep. That makes sense.

[00:39:15] It is rated 4.4 stars on Google. So, I mean, people at least must, you know, enjoy, people love all these places. Enjoy seeing it from a distance. Maybe, I don't know. Maybe you can tour it now. I don't think you can. I'm pretty sure you can. So I don't think you ever have really been able to, but all right. Next. Oh, the Mike Thadless chicken statue. Mike Thadless chicken statue. All right. That's in Fruto, right? I can say with certainty. Statue, of course, is cool.

[00:39:45] The festival. And the history is what's cool about Mike the Headless Chicken. And the story itself. Yeah. Am I thinking 1960s where this story takes place? How good's my memory? Yeah, let's pull it up real quick. I believe you're right. Oh, no. 1945. Yes. Okay. We're going back a little bit. Chicken got its head chopped off. And the chicken didn't die. The chicken did not die. And the story, the legend goes that the chicken toured the countryside. Fascinating people. Making a lot of money for its owners, too. Yes.

[00:40:15] Lived for 18 months. And they essentially fed it with a little dropper. I think eventually it choked to death. Very sad story. Yeah. It was a gruesome side of this tale. But, yeah. Now there's a festival named after him. And there is a statue in Fruta, Colorado. The statue's cool. But that's not the coolest thing about props to the artist. The roadside attractions that people can go by every day. But I'm getting at why I'm ranking it low. Well, we've got the 10 spot left.

[00:40:43] I don't think we can put it higher than that, probably. I know. Yeah. With what we already used. It's got to go 10. Yeah. Got to go 10. Hey. Great work of art. And a great bird. But... Great story. Looking at the story. And great history. But like I said, my ranking here is based more on factors beyond the stage. You know, I've never actually seen the statue in person. I wonder if there's like a little plaque. There's got to be. That tells people the story. Otherwise, it's just people walking by. Like, what is this? And some of the best pizza in the state is right around there.

[00:41:13] Oh, yeah. What's the recommendation? Hot tomato? Hot tomato? Look me up. What's in Fruta? What's that pizza place called? Double check. Yep. Hot tomato pizza. 4.8 stars on Google reviews. Awesome pizza at Fruta. So, Seth, nailing it again with the... I will travel. At 4.8, 4.9. I will drive across the state for that pizza. Looks good. All right. Yeah. What do we got next? Casa Bonita. Ooh. You know? Yeah. Still haven't gone, Spence.

[00:41:42] So, I'm going to you for this one, man. I mean, it lived up to the hype. I've been there once. And I went after the renovation. Right? So, I haven't seen it in its true glory days. We'll say. But in its new era of glory days. Yeah. It is, I think, the funniest thing. It's like from start to finish. It's just like... I mean, I said it last week where like Savannah Bananas game felt like you're living in a TikTok. Same thing with Casa Bonita, where you feel like you're living in this like just stimulation overload zone.

[00:42:11] And like our experience, when we went to Casa Bonita, you roll up to this like little strip mall off Colfax area and in Lakewood. And I think it's off Colfax. But it's just like this giant pink castle like that's part of the strip mall. It's not like it's like a standalone building. Go inside. We had a reservation. Go inside. They lead us to like the cave room, coincidentally, where the table and like it looked like the inside of a cave that you're like dining at. Super cool. They take your order. You get your food. It was fine food.

[00:42:41] It was good enough. It was good enough. The famous reviews. Yeah. Gossip video. Yeah, it was good enough. Apparently better than it used to be. I was going to say. I was happy with it. It might get some more points here. Tim says yes. Gourmet. Tim says gourmet compared to what it used to be. Should we ask Tim what he would rank in here? Yeah, maybe here. I mean, he's a Colorado native. Yeah, he's been to both.

[00:43:06] So, yeah, so after the eating, right, we spent like an hour and a half just wandering around. We watched cliff divers, went through this creepy cave thing. We saw like a magic show. There was face painting, which I did not participate in. There was a store I think I bought like similar to when I went to Bucky's. You came back with a hat. I remember. I remember $80 worth of stuff. Yeah. I remember you wearing a hat when you were back. Yeah, I can't help myself when I go to those stores. So, but yeah, Tim, what would you rank it here?

[00:43:36] Getting in the top five, Timmy? Because I've got an idea. So, we've got seven left, right? Or we've got one, two, three, four, five, seven. Okay. Put it at four. I was thinking. Yeah. It's probably great. Yeah. I think in the top five. I'm pretty happy with the four rank. All right. All right. Tim contributing on the ranking with the four. So, now our... Tim. It would be much better if we consulted you on a lot of these topics. Because our fans accuse us of not being natives.

[00:44:06] For some reason, you have to be a native to really love this state. So, we have to consult Tim. We got to. We'll see what he thinks about the end of this list. All right. Let's see if he approves. All right. So, we've got the first place ranking, second place ranking, third place ranking, fifth place ranking, and seventh place ranking left. So, five more attractions. I got it. Ooh. Wild Animal Sanctuary. Pretty bonkers. Wild Animal Sanctuary.

[00:44:32] That one's known for having the mile in the sky walkway, like boardwalk, where you go over lions, tigers, and bears. Yeah. Oh, my. Lions, tigers, bears. You know, I've never been there. So, all right. It seems cool, though. Have you been there? It's very cool. I have been there. Yeah. And it's a nice facility. I don't know if people recognize that. Like, they see the outside. And like you alluded to it, these walkways that go over the top of these lions, tigers, bears, oh, my. But it's a nice facility.

[00:45:02] You know? There's a very beloved organization there tending to these rescue animals and bringing them to the plains of northern Colorado. Located northeast of Denver. Pretty crazy. Yeah. That, I think that's cranking the top five, too, bro. I think, yeah, I was going to say maybe a five. I think it's a five spot. Three or five. I'd go five. Five? All right. Let's go five. I mean, because here's the thing.

[00:45:31] You do got to drive out to the perilous plains where you don't know what the weather is going to be. That is true. That is true. Keensburg, right? Yeah. Keensburg. I'd have to imagine those lions aren't too used to, like, giant hailstorms coming. They got to take for cover. Yeah. At least from their roots, wherever they came from. Some of them are from the Tiger King ship. Yeah. They get a lot of attention during the Tiger King drama. It's a pretty bonkers place. All right. So we're going five? Yeah. Let's go five.

[00:45:59] So we got one, two, three, and seven left. Okay. The tank. Oh, we just talked about the tank. Yeah. So I feel like there's going to be people not familiar with this tank. It's this... Out in Rangely. Bizarre sonic phenomenon out in far western Colorado. This old water storage tank that never came to fruition. And years went by and locals discovered that the echoing sound of this tank is beyond belief.

[00:46:27] And now sonic adventurers from around the world come to this tank in rural Colorado. They do concerts and stuff. They do concerts and experiments. What comes to mind here, and I could be off on this, but fairly limited in its public aspects. Yeah. I think it was like Saturdays, I want to say. It's on the website. Yeah. Check the website. It was like a good chunk of time. There's concerts here and there. And it is a water tank. Yeah.

[00:46:54] So is it a three or is it a seven? It's probably a seven. Seven? All right. But I'll take your advice there because I have not been out there. That's another one where I have not seen it in person. But again, an experience that some have likened to the greatest sanctuaries on the planet. Yeah. So this has to be said. Did they compare it to like St. Peter's Basilica? Yeah. Which is wild.

[00:47:16] People who are tuned into tunes to sound know that the tank is otherworldly. Yeah. It is an old water storage tank. 4.7 stars. There's a lot of marvelous things in this state. Yeah. All right. So that's seven. All right. Bishop Castle. That's kind of one. That's a one might be. Probably a one for me. Yeah.

[00:47:43] I think from the story to how it's free and accessible by design. And how that's like something that creator, the late Jim Bishop took pride in. Yeah. Was that it was something that's free to visit. Yeah. I think that that's important. In a beautiful, often overlooked landscape. Yes. Of Colorado. Yeah. Big points for that part of San Isabel National Forest and that lake up the road there, San Isabel. Yeah.

[00:48:11] Recently just survived the Aspen Acres fire. Bishop Castle has a lot going for it, man. Yeah. I think it's got to be one. I'm happy with that at one. All right. Yeah. I can't think of anything. I don't even know what the next two are. We're going to see. Yeah. I can't think of anything in the state. As far as roadside attractions go, it is a true roadside attraction. Park your car. Explore the castle. Yeah. Yeah. Hard to beat. 160 feet tall, too. Wow. Like by the hands of one man. Yeah.

[00:48:41] Yeah. All right. All right. Next. The final two for the second and third place spot. Two and three. All of our positions are locked in, too. I got it. Maybe not as great. Let's see how we do. I have a feeling there's a Coney dog coming up here. Okay. All right. Coney Island hot dog stand. I can't believe I haven't been to that. Yeah. I mean, I haven't been to that. Right here. Close to the front. Coney Island hot dog stand. Let's see what it. I mean, let's see what the internet has to say about this. None of these other places serves hot dogs as far as I know. All right.

[00:49:11] So I think it is 3.9 stars on Google reviews. Mm-hmm. I mean, we have two and three left, but it's a 1950s diner shaped like a giant hot dog with toppings located in the Bailey area. It has kind of been featured in South Park, the TV show. Like, at one point, Cartman and his mom move into a hot dog stand. So, I mean, there's some cultural relevance there. Hot dogs are awesome. Yeah. I mean, I don't, you know, I'm not going to shame any hot dog in the top three. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:49:41] I'm fine with that. I want to see what these hot dogs are like. Give it three and hope that we come through on two. Can we still, can people still go there and get hot dogs? Like, is it just like straight up hot dog shop? I feel like I saw a reader comment not too long ago saying the hot dogs were phenomenal. Okay. Well, hey, phenomenal hot dogs. I'm happy with three. It's phenomenal hot dogs. I'm good with three. Now we got to hope that our two is all right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It looks good. They have an Elk and cheddar. Cheddar. El jalapeno cheddar option. Yeah. All right. A little slice of Coney Island. Tommy Malker. In the mountains of Colorado.

[00:50:10] That's pretty cool. Yeah. I'll take it. Patch green chili one. All right. Bring us home, Tim. That's three. World's Wanderview Tower. Wow. Sneaking its way into second place. Wow. You know, it recently reopened. Known for being out on the eastern plains. Home to all sorts of bizarre oddities, correct? I mean, you've covered it in depth. Yeah. So, yeah. I went to go visit it during this effort to revitalize it.

[00:50:39] Got to know the history there. Gosh, I got to brush up on that history. But generations have loved the world's Wanderview Tower. From which, what? What do they claim? You can see six states or something like that? Yeah. It was built around like 1930 as well. Mm-hmm. As kind of like a gas station stop, right? And then they started just adding stuff to it. Back in the era, same era where like the fossilized, or what is it? The petrified wood gas station. That's right. Popped up.

[00:51:06] Kind of like that idea of like pulling people into your gas station by doing something else other than just gas. A true scene of Americana. And honestly, a true roadside attraction. Yeah. Like invented as a roadside attraction. Yeah. And you know what? I think we can be proud of putting at number two the roadside attraction that is coming back to life. The great roadside attraction of Colorado that is coming back to life on the eastern plains. So, yeah. Good with it, man. Yeah. Good with it. A true roadside attraction.

[00:51:34] I'm curious about the future of the World's Wonderview Tower, too. Yes. Yeah. And you can go visit it now, right? Yeah. I don't know what access looks like, Spence. It says it. So, it says now open on Fridays and Saturdays from 10 to 5 through Labor Day. Okay. So, people can maybe sneak in there here before Labor Day. There you go. Pops up. I don't know if you can go up to the top of the tower or not. I did see somebody that was published a YouTube video where they were up at the top of the tower. Yeah. Yeah. A true roadside attraction that has been given new life. That's right. Yeah.

[00:52:04] The focus of this years-long revitalization effort. What's some of the weird stuff that's there, too? Wasn't there like a two-headed cow or three-headed? That's right. Something like that. They had a snake pit. Yeah. Snake pit. Yeah. I'm remembering they had a snake pit there. They had like murals of Pikes Peak, which you can see. Yeah. It was a long time ago. I haven't looked at that story in a long time. Yeah. But a really great history. And what's it by? What's the town? By? It is by? Lamar?

[00:52:34] No. No. It's off I-70, right? Yeah. Genoa? Genoa. Yeah. By Genoa. Yeah. So if you're out on the eastern plains driving through I-70, you can see it from the road. But maybe pop over there and check it out. It used to be like a cafe. You know, people pulled off to have a cafe. Lots of memories of like prom nights over there. Yeah. Yeah. There's like all sorts of cool history about that. That's like sometimes they'll say like Colorado feels like the Midwest in ways. Totally.

[00:53:03] Prom nights at the Wonder View Tower feels like a Midwest prom night. It's just me saying this. There's no plans for this. But I've imagined like a music festival there. Oh, that'd be cool. That I think would be bonkers. Maybe they'll hear this and be like, that's a good idea. Yeah. All right. So what is our final list here then? We got one, Bishop's Castle. Two, Wonder View. Three, the Hot Dog Stand. Coney Island Hot Dog Stand. Four was Castle Bonita.

[00:53:32] Five, the Wild Animal Sanctuary. Six, what was six? Gator Park. Gator Park. Yeah. Seven is the Tank. Yes. Eight is the Maybug Museum. Nine, Cannell Castle. Ten, the statue of Mike the Headless Chicken. Honestly, I'm pretty happy with that list. Pretty good with that list. Yeah. Are there going to be some people saying Castle Bonita needs to be bumped up? Yeah. Maybe. Maybe. Might be people saying, does the Gator Park need to be bumped up? Yeah. Maybe.

[00:54:00] I could see the Gator Park being bumped up too. I love the Gator Park. Can't go around with any of them, right? Oh, yeah. Every single one of these. Worth visiting. Worth checking out. Weird in their own ways. Weird indeed. Weird in wonderful Colorado. So, that list defines that for sure. Yeah. There we go. Well, hey. I think that's about time we wrap up the show here. Sweet. Midweek, we'll chat about the 150 things to do. Oh, yeah. Make sure we revisit that topic. Yeah, Seth brought in his... I brought in my literature today.

[00:54:30] Yeah, there you go. Look at that beautiful mountain photo on top of that. New magazine we put together. The Colorado Living Magazine. Yeah. So, hey. We'll chat about that. Midweek, we'll chat about some base camps for fall as well. It's coming up. I think that'll be a good conversation. We're going to start seeing some pictures. We already are. Mm-hmm. You see this? Some fall color photos going out. Yeah. Still a little bit of debate over whether it's probably the dryness. It's drought showing itself. Right, right. But, yeah. Either way. Fall will be upon us soon. Until next time. I'm Spencer. I'm Seth.

[00:55:00] We'll see you out there.

[00:55:32] Bishop Castle. Very nice. Double finger point. All you need is one take there. Thank you. Thank you.