David Linde: Why Sundance Film Festival Left Park City for Boulder

[00:00:00] Alright, so we are here in Boulder, Colorado and only for about the third or fourth time are we doing the Bear Roars podcast in front of a live audience. And we're doing it here at 8Z, a real estate company in town of Boulder. Thank you for letting us use your facility. 8Z is one of the 20 plus venues for Tulagi Music Fest.

[00:00:28] So Tulagi is going to be taking over Boulder over the next four days. And it's kind of building on momentum here in Boulder that's been created and we have with us here, Dan Caruso, who's the CEO of Sundance Institute. David, what is most on your mind? Just about everything is on my mind, to be honest. But, you know, I was just thinking before I got here that typically I don't do a lot of outward facing interviews, things like that.

[00:00:57] I like to rely on the people who are really running the show. But when I got this invitation, you know, I thought, of course I have to do this, right? I have to do it because, you know, it's a big move. It's a big move to Boulder. We were in Park City for 40 pretty great years, but now we're here. We've relocated.

[00:01:16] But whether it's the state of Colorado, the city of Boulder, individuals like yourself, you know, that level of welcoming that we're feeling amongst the community here and community is central to what the Institute and the festival does is really kind of overwhelming. And so I was like, yeah, I'll do it. Right. Okay. And I'm really, really pleased to be here and I really, really, really appreciate it. Well, I could feel the community of Boulder and the community of Colorado coming together more.

[00:01:44] Like a lot of areas in the country right now, there's kind of some division there. You know, if you're more this way or more that way, you kind of, instead of getting together and discussing your points of view, you kind of get on opposite camps. At least that's been the trend. But I feel like we're on a track to kind of change that. And we're on track to change that because celebrating art and celebrating culture, celebrating community.

[00:02:09] And I think that's so important. And I'm so pleased to be witnessing that firsthand. So thank you and welcome to Boulder. Thank you very much. But, but, you know, the beauty of art and the beauty, you know, whether it's your music festival or, or it's other kinds of performance and things like that is, it really hit me home a couple of years ago when I'm good friends with a woman named Ai-jen Poo, who is probably one of the leading sort of social advocates in this country.

[00:02:34] She's on the board of the Ford Foundation. She was a Time 100. If you ever look her up, she's incredible. And she said to me a couple of years ago, you know, David, when I walk out the door and I look around, and I know that 50% of the people probably don't agree with my perspectives, which I'm okay with, except that today it's so hard to convince people with facts. Right? And people distrust facts. And they don't know, they're not sure what they should really believe in.

[00:03:02] And I think that one of the roles of, whether it's Tulagi or Sundance or things like that, is the importance of the shared experience. Right? And there's, there's really nothing like to your point about in the case of cinema, of people going to whether it's a documentary or it's a narrative feature or things like that, sitting next to other people and seeing an experience that they have not experienced before.

[00:03:26] Or hearing a language that they have not heard before. Or seeing somebody in a circumstance that they have not experienced before. And that's, I think, how we're going to really begin to sort of build up our collaboration and community and things like that. And the chance that we can, and that's what artists are all about, right? Artists are about seeing around the corner about the most important issues of our time and entertaining people at the same time. And that's really a lot of what the festival is about.

[00:03:54] And the opportunity to do it in both Boulder and the entire Denver metro area. And it's a great, great opportunity for connection. And we're super excited. So it'll be great. Another topic of our time and one we cover quite a bit in the Bear Roars podcast is technology and more specifically, AI.

[00:04:14] AI is looming. AI is going to change or bring change about to our future. And that affects art, culture, it affects humankind in general. So in a lot of ways, you know, the division between people, I look at it as we've got this other thing looming called AI. And we need to kind of rally around each other so that AI doesn't get the better of us, but we get the better of AI.

[00:04:39] And I think that's another common ground. You know, when we think about the effects of AI, we think about how are humans going to be spending their time? How are they going to engage with the real world? How are they going to, how are their lives going to change? How is art going to be created? How are artists going to express themselves? And how is the technology that is going to be used for the creation of art and to the help of artists?

[00:05:06] How is that going to work together? So I think that's another thing I'm really excited about with Sundance, you know, sparking this big change in Boulder and the Colorado community is the collaboration between artists and technology and navigation toward our AI future. How do you think about that more from an art perspective? Well, I think about, you know, undoubtedly the conversation around AI is one of the most important conversations in the world of cinema right now.

[00:05:34] And the depth of the technology and the speed of the technology is advancing and things like that is something that we're absolutely going to be talking about at the festival and panels and discussions and things like that. And it is central to the conversation in Los Angeles, especially right now. Like how are we integrating AI in a way that really takes a human approach to the application of the many, many different AI kinds of apps that are available.

[00:06:04] And I went to a, we actually have a collaboration with Google where we're talking about really what is the authentic way to use. We're collaborating with Google and, and I think it's nine other like minded organizations around an initiative that's really about how do we use AI authentically, right? How do we use AI authentically and from a human approach and independent film? We'll be talking a lot about that during the festival.

[00:06:30] But, you know, I went to a conference where the singer songwriter producer everything Will.i.am spoke and there were a bunch of speakers and his really hit home. I'm actually hoping that we can attract him to the, to the festival and maybe speak over at CU and things like that.

[00:06:50] But he very, very quickly went through because he's a singer, he's a songwriter, actor, performer, you know, musician, everything. He uses a lot of AI apps to sort of advance the way that he creates. And it was, I had never, I had never been exposed to the depth of what's available to, you know, improve, to speed up the process in an authentic way.

[00:07:17] And so the crowd was really mesmerized and he's a great speaker. And at the end he said, he stopped and he said, just remember one thing, don't let it get ahead of you. Right? And I thought that that was just one of those moments where there was a group of filmmakers and executives and things like that. And those kind of clairvoyant moments that can happen with artists is something that we really want to bring into the festival.

[00:07:43] And I think it'll be really dynamic and it'll be really interesting and it'll really advance the conversation. Yeah. And it's going to be great to wait, to see how you're going to interweave kind of discussions, topics with the film, with the celebrations, the networking, kind of the whole package. Very excited about that. So you're investing a little bit of money here in Boulder. Tell us what kind of- I'm doing what? Say again? You're investing a little bit of money in our town of Boulder.

[00:08:09] You're putting some money into venues and theaters and tell us what all is going on there. Well, you know, I'm going to quote Eugene Hernandez who runs the festival, who's sitting right over there. Hey Eugene, where are you? Oh, there you are. But Eugene puts it really, really well, which is we're growing the festival, right? We've come to Boulder. We had 40 years of, you know, wonder in Park City.

[00:08:36] We were super appreciative of everything that everybody in Park City and Utah contributed to the process. And now we're coming to Boulder and it's a different template and we're growing what the opportunity is. And we're in the midst of, I think there are nine theaters, right? Or 11? Nine. There are nine theaters and another group of venues that we're going to use for panel discussions and convenings and things like that.

[00:09:00] But of all the other theaters in Boulder, they're all within 2.4 miles of each other. The last couple of years in Park City, we had, I think, four or five theaters in Park City. We had a group of theaters in Salt Lake City and we used another multiplex that was about 20 minutes down the road by Highway 80. So the festival had become quite spread out. Here it's the exact opposite, right? It's actually very condensed.

[00:09:30] And the level of work that's going into the installation of gold standard equipment into all these theaters is as high as it can be. And it's really expensive, but it's called the gold standard and that's what we want to have here. And the example that we all use is we're in the midst of retrofitting the Mackie on the Colorado campus.

[00:09:56] We're installing 245 speakers in the ceiling of the Mackie. It seats 1,900 people. And then you think about what really excites us is here's this beautiful theater sitting smack dab in front of 36,000 kids. Right? And the opportunity, you know, and what's going on in cinema today is that that demographic of about 17 to 34

[00:10:25] is returning to the theater. And the opportunity to land three theaters, right, on that campus is something that we've never had before. And the idea, the option to interact on a consistent basis with these kids to bring filmmakers onto their campus, to give them the opportunity to hear them speak and converse and ask questions and do all that stuff is tremendously exciting. And it's really important to us.

[00:10:54] Well, tonight at the kickoff for Tulagi, the chancellor of CU is going to be there. The governor is going to be there. And the deans of a couple of the schools at CU are going to be there. Athletic director as well. So one thing we're going to talk about once they experience Tulagi is how to bring Tulagi onto the campus next year as well. Maybe focusing on the Mackey Theater and then focusing on the Hill, which is adjacent to the campus.

[00:11:18] In fact, that's where the Tulagi name came from was Tulagi on the Hill right next to the campus so that we draw the students kind of into this and this into the students as well. You know, I think one thing that makes Boulder so special, and there's a few other communities like this as well, is the proximity of CU Boulder and the core of Boulder, including where the tech ecosystem is.

[00:11:42] So the innovation theme that will bring CU Boulder together with, you know, the post-graduation innovations that take place is going to be strengthened by Sundance and all that we're doing here. So that's another big upside for what's being created. It's a huge, I mean, I had a conversation with one of the officials in the governor's office, what about three months ago or something like that. And they said, you know, what are you doing about technology as part of the festival?

[00:12:11] And I said, well, you know, we're going to have to have conversations about AI because especially for the artists and things like that, advancing those conversations is super important, right? And being able to access the knowledge base in Boulder around AI and tech and things like that is going to be really, you know, not to be repetitive, but huge, right? Really huge. So I said, why are you asking me this question?

[00:12:38] She said, well, you know, we graduate 6,000 kids from CU every year, right? And they need jobs. And I said, okay, that's really interesting. So we're really talking about workforce development, right? So I went back to New York and my wife who works in the nonprofit business was talking to one of the bigger New York-based philanthropies who I can't name today, but we will be naming. And she had a meeting with them and she came back and she said, you know, they're there.

[00:13:08] It's interesting. They're really, really interested in supporting workforce development. And I was like, okay, give me that phone number. So I called the relevant executive at the philanthropy and I said, I hear you guys are really involved in sponsoring and working around workforce development in metropolitan areas around the country. And they were like, we are. And I said, well, we've got this festival. We're going to be in Boulder. We've got this university.

[00:13:36] Is there some way that we can connect your expertise and what it is that you're doing with the festival? And they said, let us give it some thought. Last week, Paula Dupree Pestman, who I fondly refer to as Pamela. It's an inside joke. But anyway, she and I had a meeting with this philanthropy last week.

[00:14:02] And they're going to sponsor their first panel discussion around workforce development and probably the film industry during the festival here. But it's their goal actually to make it a year long thing in Boulder where they can consistently sponsor. And they have a lot of expertise. They work around the country. And they're really looking to make this. There will be one, right, we think. But the plan is to do it all year round.

[00:14:36] And we have here with us in the audience Wendy Lee, who's, this is near and dear to a lot of the work she does on behalf of Colorado and even beyond Colorado. And there's, you know, one of the very large AI4 tech companies who we're having similar discussions on her leadership with. And it would be good to connect those dots. We'll talk about that offline. And we already are, kind of. We are. We just need to thread it.

[00:15:05] Yes, exactly. So we can make it happen. But next week is an important one. Wendy goes, go that way. And there we go. Okay, so tell us what to expect when January, that date hits in January and people start to arrive in Boulder. Walk us through what Sundance Film Festival is all about. Well, I'm going to quote Eugene again.

[00:15:32] This festival is, and I'm speaking to the people here, and I'm speaking to the people who are going to listen to the podcast, right? Yes. This festival is about you, right? And it really is, right? It is these filmmakers are going to come here. The majority of them are going to be having the premiere of their films. They will never have been seen by audiences at all. And they're going to be excited and nervous and anticipating things. And they're really here to show you their work, right?

[00:16:02] That's why they're coming. And what, you know, it's, that's, this, the festival is really for the people who attend it, right? And when, one of the, what you'll experience when you get here is, the festival is, is really organized around three different periods of time over 11 days. So, um, there's a preconception that it's all about the industry. That's not an actual, that's not true at all.

[00:16:28] The huge majority of people who attend screenings are not from the industry. Um, uh, tickets are available to everybody. And so, um, but you will see in the first five days a lot of people from the industry, right? And they're there to see, to see films, uh, to, to, you know, identify talent, uh, to buy distribution rights to movies and things like that. And we premiere all of the films in the first five days.

[00:16:56] And so there you'll see them running around, phones on, you know, talking to each other, you know, talking to people to find out what they like and what's good. And, and the kind of film that they're sort of inclined to buy or the kind of filmmaker that they're interested in attracting. Um, and it's kind of exciting, you know, and it's fun. And, uh, and at the same time, a lot of the directors and actors and producers will be milling around and, and around the, around the town.

[00:17:21] And you'll see them and you'll have the option to, to interact with them in Q and A's after all the screenings and things like that. And then after five days, the industry people have to get back to work in Los Angeles and New York and London and Paris and all these places. So they will drift away. Um, and then it becomes a, the tenor of the festival changes a little bit, right?

[00:17:42] Um, but this, the, the directors stay, right? Some of the actors stay and things like that, because to, this is a special moment for them, right? It really is, it's, it's the culmination. It's so hard to make a movie, right? And it's so complex. And it's, and it's like, it's such a relief to, to come and be able to interact with people.

[00:18:04] And so we screen all the films again, right? And that's also when I think we're going to really, um, hope that the students, um, will have the opportunity to see as many movies as possible. Um, and then it becomes a whole different conversation, right? It becomes a conversation. What have you seen, right? You know? Oh, I want to go to the theater. I want to go to that because that person is speaking or something like that. And then I'd layer in one other thing, which is the volunteers.

[00:18:29] We have 2,000 volunteers from the area, right? And you'll, you'll, you'll know them. They're all going to have jackets on, that it'll be some big bright colors that identifies them. Um, and they're, you know, the work that they do for the festival is integral, right? And the huge majority of them will be from the community.

[00:18:49] And then after that period of time, um, after the, is the awards, um, where we give out, we give out a series of awards for narrative film, documentary, acting, directing, everything. I, I told Dan this. The, uh, first I was, um, running the international group of Miramax Films and I was in New York and I wasn't going to come that year.

[00:19:13] In 92, because I was focusing on, um, on the international business and I got a call saying, you gotta get here. We just saw a movie that we think is really special and that we, we think we want to buy, but we need your opinion. And I was like, okay, I'll come out. So I, I flew out to, uh, Salt Lake City and, and, um, Park City, drove the car as fast as I could get, got there just in time for the screening.

[00:19:38] So I was in the front row in a, sort of small theater in, in Park City. And that movie was Reservoir Dogs. Um, uh, and Quentin Tarantino came up and spoke afterwards. And to me that that was, um, and Quentin had gone through our artist programs, um, and it was a perfect example of the Institute itself, which was, um, and we can talk a little bit about the art.

[00:20:02] I'd like to talk a little bit about the artist programs. But, um, it was a moment, right, that just captured the moment. And here was this kid, right, who had developed his craft through our, through our, through the Institute and the artist programs. And there, lo and behold, he was premiering his film. And he kind of changed the world. It was great. Reservoir Dogs was a nice sentimental movie too. So we're... Try the front row.

[00:20:32] So, uh, part of being in front of a live audience is we get to take some questions. So Susan, would you like to come up to the bike here? Thank you so much. Um, David, can you talk a little bit about how many films get submitted to Sundance? And the process of how they are accepted? Like, who gets in? Yeah. Thank you. Uh, so the programming team is run by Eugene Hernandez, who's the director of the festival. And, uh, a woman named... Eugene, you want to come up here and sit and...

[00:21:02] All right. And a woman named Kim Yutani, who is the director of programming. Um, and they have what I consider to be the best programming team of any film festival in, uh, in the... In North America. Uh, I think there are 15 total, right? Um, and they work all year round in, you know, we're... We want the best films, right? And so, and I'm gonna...

[00:21:30] And I'm about to hit you with the number in two seconds, okay? So they're all year round, they're circulating around the world, going to other film festivals. We pride ourselves about our relationships with other film festivals. We try to be as supportive of each other as possible. Um, and then at about June, we open up, we begin to very carefully open up submissions.

[00:21:50] And we're anticipating that between documentaries, narrative features, episodic programming, and short films, that they will see 16,000 titles. Um, uh, and we accept about 150. Wow. So, um, it's a... and they watch everything. What's amazing to me is they actually watch everything. And so, it's an incredible job, and, uh, they're super talented people and super committed, and...

[00:22:17] And we're all very, very lucky, um, that they're part of this. So you wanted to tell us a little bit about some of the artist programs? So, you know, the organization was created... Thank you. It was created about 45 years ago by Mr. Redford. Um, uh, I always... I had... I had the opportunity, um... You know, a lot of us, you know, I, you know, grew up with some of my favorite movies, Robert Redford's, but some people are gonna listen to this who are younger and probably don't really know all that much about Robert Redford.

[00:22:47] Can you, uh, tell us a little bit about who he was and how important he was, uh, during his era of film? I, I, I'd like to think of him as someone like, uh, you know, a Brad Pitt, you know, in today's world, perhaps. But tell us about how you think of him. Well, um, Brad Pitt's a good example, you know, well... The Sting, by the way. The Sting and The Natural are... Um, uh, well, you know, he went to the University of Colorado, actually. Um, uh, um... Um, uh...

[00:23:15] And, you know, I call him Mr. Redford because I worked on one movie with him, and he produced a movie called Motorcycle Diaries that, uh, I was fortunate enough to buy the distribution rights, and I remembered, um, you know, and he's just an icon. Incredible actor, incredible director, Oscar-winning actor, director, everything. And, unbelievably committed person, right?

[00:23:39] And committed to art, uh, committed to the expression of art, committed to artists, committed to performance, um, and very, very much committed to humanity, right? And, you know, the, the goal of, and I'll get into nature and the thing, was... Well, actually, I'll just jump right into it. So, so about 45 years ago, he and some friends and colleagues created what we call the Artist Programs.

[00:24:05] Um, and, uh, essentially, the Artist Programs are, um, there are nine of them at the moment. I think there are nine of them at the moment. But they range from the feature film program, which includes directors, screenwriters, producers. It includes an episodic program. We're, we're extremely proud of our Indigenous Filmmakers Program.

[00:24:29] Um, we're very, very, we've just brought back another program, which is called Women in Sundance. Um, which we had not been using for various reasons in, in, uh, in, uh, in the last couple of years. But it's a vital program right now, because there's something going on in Hollywood, which is that few, it, there was a period of time where more women were getting more jobs as directors, writers, producers, and things like that. That's now decreasing, right?

[00:24:56] And we consider it our, our real obligation to do something about that. So the programs give grants, they give fellowships, and we rent, and we, uh, to, you know, all sorts of artists. Um, but sort of the core is what we call the labs, right? Where, uh, throughout the year, um, we support, you know, the, that I should talk about, back to Mr. Redford, right? What's our mission, right?

[00:25:21] In there, and I'm not going to speak on Mr. Redford's behalf, but I'll tell you my version of the mission is, we are here to nurture and support artists, right? And we are here to create an environment where they are most comfortable in learning their craft and developing their craft. And that's what we think of, and, and I think that that's, you know, we've been doing it for 45 years,

[00:25:46] and it really makes this place singular and individual and, uh, and very, very special. And so we have about 600 people go through our artist programs every year from all around the world. Um, and they are the beginning, right? They're the beginning of what it means to take part in the Sundance Institute. But it doesn't stop with the artist program. And I should also, big shout out to Michelle Satter, uh, who is the head of the artist program.

[00:26:15] She's been doing it for 40 years. Um, if you ever get the chance to attend, it's amazing to see the way that she, she brings in all these incredible mentors and guides and people who have had tremendous success in the industry and provides this very beautiful, connective experience for these artists to develop their craft together, um, in a, in a completely unique way. Um, so anyway, so the artist program is all, where it all works.

[00:26:45] It all all begins, right? But it's an ecosystem, the Institute. And the ecosystem is, and then I'll get, I should get back to Redford. But, um, uh, the ecosystem starts with the artist programs. Um, and then the next stage of our sort of flywheel is what we call Sundance CoLab, which is effectively the democratization of the artist labs because we can only handle so many artists going through the lab in person. But it's our educational platform.

[00:27:14] And it's essentially a replication of the artist programs on a much broader scale. We currently have people participating in the CoLab in 170 different countries. Um, so it's pretty special as well. And it's, it's actually something that we want to invest more in because we think it's a great opportunity for people to really experience sort of the ethos and creativity of the Institute.

[00:27:37] We have a third program that we call Catalyst, which is where, um, we marry over the course of a year, um, people who are interested in funding independent film. Typically, you know, a lot of the, the filmmakers that we're working with are quite young. Um, and, um, um, uh, and so the budgets are often quite low, um, which is, we think, a great way to initiate people's careers.

[00:28:02] So Catalyst marries, um, funders with filmmakers and producers over the course of a year, um, and enables people to interact in a way that we think is very authentic to really understanding how complicated the film business is. And really going into the funding of a, of a, of a film in a way that they are as educated as possible.

[00:28:24] And at the same time, the filmmakers are as educated as possible about what it means to raise funding and, and, uh, and, uh, and the budgets for film. So that's the sort of the third part of the cycle of living, uh, the Sundance ecosystem. And then the fourth, of course, is the, is the film festival. And is the primary outward facing, uh, look at, at, uh, of what the institute is.

[00:28:49] And there are people who have been in the artist programs, have taught in Colab, have had their films funded by Catalyst, and then have had their films premiere in the film festival. And that's completely unique. There's no one else that does that. That, that is what makes us singular. And it's a, it's an amazing experience. And, you know, I'm incredibly proud that I was chosen to, to lead this organization.

[00:29:16] But when you come to the film festival and see it, think of it as a, as a whole thing, right? A whole thing that you can actually take part in at the festival, but you can also take part in Colab, right? And you can meet the artists who have gone through the artist programs when you come to the festival and things like that. And that's, you know, that's the community that we're trying to build because we are based in community. And we believe in, and now I'm, now I'm almost pitching you. So you should all reply to the artist programs.

[00:29:44] Um, uh, um, uh, but that really is, there's nobody else who does that. Nobody. There's nobody in the, not in this country, not in Europe, not in Asia, nobody else does that. And that's what makes us unique. So back to Mr. Redford, one of the greatest actors of our time, for sure. You know, Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid being one of my favorite movies, I can tell you exactly in which drive-in in Eugene, Oregon I saw it. You know?

[00:30:09] Um, but again was a man of incredible heart, of incredible commitment, and of, and of incredible imagination. Right? And really gave back to the community in a way that was unprecedented. And part of, for Paula and Eugene and me and the others, Dana over there who worked for the Institute, we're incredibly lucky because there are people who are very close friends of Mr. Redford's who are still on our board.

[00:30:39] And we have that, his daughter is on our board. Right? And we have that continuity back to him in ways that, you know, we might not have. Right? If it, if the Institute had been developed in a different way. And that's like a treasure. Right? It's really a treasure of connectivity. And so we feel very connected to 45 years ago. Right? And, and, and how it all came about.

[00:31:04] And then the last thing I'd, I'd like to add which is really important for Boulder is nature was really incredibly important to the Redfords. Right? And, um, the idea of being an artist in a natural, um, environment and community was really, really important because it was that connection to nature that, uh, that, that he really felt.

[00:31:29] And so coming back to Boulder, you know, I came in on Monday night and it was a huge rainstorm. And, uh, I was driving on 36 and, uh, I, and came over that hill where you see the flat irons and everything. And the rain, the rain was, and I'm going to get sort of maudlin, but I'm, uh, the rain was, was, was, um, fading and the sunshine was breaking through the clouds and you could see it.

[00:31:55] And I was like, wow, man, when the, when the, when the artists get here, right? Yeah. They've never been to Boulder, right? They're going to come over that hill and they're going to go, oh, right. We're here, right? We're here. So it's going to be great. It's going to be great. And then they're going to say, we got to come back in August. Is there anything going on in August? Yeah. Exactly. Well, you know, you know, actually, you know, I didn't, I, I, I left that out, right?

[00:32:22] And so, um, you know, music used to be a super important part of the, of the festival. And, um, with COVID and everything, you know, COVID was hard on us. It was really hard on us. Yes. And so Eugene is in the midst of sort of figuring out how to integrate music and Paula back into the festival, but having this, your festival sort of in advance of that, right? And amplifying the importance of music and its connectivity only helps us, right?

[00:32:51] It makes us stronger and it makes us more, you know, thorough and excited. So, you know, kudos to you guys. And supports the venues and, you know, and the scene around here, but it's a, it's 10 days, 11 days. And we need to find kind of ways to keep the artists, the venues, uh, the art kind of vibrant throughout. And I know you guys are very committed to that, not just here in Boulder, but throughout Colorado and how that connects to Sundance, Sundance Institute altogether. And very, very exciting.

[00:33:21] And, and you, you touched on a couple of your personal stories. I'm going to ask you to kind of, as I, as I talk for a minute or two, to think about some of your most interesting personal stories. I mean, it's about late night parties, uh, private parties, dinners, um, meetings, uh, where deals are being done and businesses being done and, you know, and connections are being made.

[00:33:45] I mean, there's so much going on and some of that is with, you know, a lot of that is within the industry, the film industry, but a lot of that is the community around it as well. How do you get the most out of that, you know, period of time in terms of, uh, just the overall energy, excitement, vibrancy of it?

[00:34:03] So with that as a little bit of a backdrop, what kind of stories do you have in your, uh, memory banks, you know, things that occurred during Sundance Film Festival week, uh, whether they're, you know, some of the business feelings you barely touched on, but, you know, maybe you could expand a little bit more on or other kinds of things that were just crazy or experiences that you had memories that you'd like to share. Well, I can't share them all. That's for sure. Yeah, let's start with the ones that you can't share.

[00:34:32] Um, well, look, I was, I was a little bit of my background. I grew up in Eugene, Oregon. I was, I was, uh, uh, super lucky that, um, my father was a German Jewish refugee and, uh, my mother grew up in a small town on the coast in Oregon. And, and they met in high school in Portland and, and were married, uh, for 75 years.

[00:34:58] And, um, to them, culture was unbelievably important. My dad was an academic and a legal scholar and, and, uh, my mom was the smartest person I ever knew, but, but, you know, was basically took care of my dad. Um, but, you know, they had lived, they had grown up in the, in the 30s and, and experienced a lot of, a lot of heartache and a lot of, of difficulty. And to them, culture was the most important thing.

[00:35:27] And they believed very, very strongly that if you didn't actually understand, you know, people, if you didn't under, didn't have appreciation for their language, for their culture, for their art, then you were actually disappointing yourself. Right? And so I was incredibly fortunate in that, and, uh, I mean, I lived in Europe when I was seven or eight. I lived in Europe when I was 15 or 16.

[00:35:54] My parents encouraged me to just go out into the world. Um, first time I was in Boulder, I was, uh, I, I was 19 and I was going to college in Pennsylvania. My parents sent me an airplane ticket and I, I was like, hey, I could just cash this out and hitchhike across the country. And I did. And I did. And, and I remember when I told my parents and they were like, well, just give us a call when you get here. And I was like, okay, here I go. And that was my first visit to Boulder, actually. Um, but I was super lucky, right?

[00:36:23] And, and I, and I was really exposed to a lot of things. And so I really feel quite deeply about, about all the things that we're, that we're talking about. But when I, long story, I thought I was going to go to law school, and then I was really like, I'll be a terrible lawyer. Um, um, um, and I really wanted to be in the film business. I really, really wanted to go. And it took me a while to get there. Um, but eventually I did.

[00:36:50] And, and, you know, I'll tell you a funny story about, um, when I was running Focus Features. I, uh, um, we saw a movie. It was the film Mr. Redford, uh, produced called Motorcycle Diaries. Um, and, uh, directed by Walter Salas, starring Gabriel Garcia Bernal, who I'd made another movie called E2 on the time beyond with.

[00:37:18] And, um, we watched it, and it was great. And we loved it, and we were like, we want this one, right? So we were up all night long, um, in a restaurant in Park City. And, and the other competition was in one room in the restaurant, and we were in the other room. And the people selling the movie were going back and forth, bidding us up and bidding us up. And we finally got it.

[00:37:44] And, uh, and literally at, like, two in the morning or something like that, we signed the deal memo. And we were so excited. And everybody from the company was around. And we went to somebody's condo and drank way too much and just had a great time. And went back and, and, uh, uh, went to, went to, you know, slept for about two hours. And then I had to go back to New York. And I was talking to my assistant who was in town. I was like, you know, have you seen anything while you were here that you really liked?

[00:38:14] And he said, yeah, yeah. He said, um, uh, I saw a really funny film last night. You know, while you guys were going through this thing. And it's really good. And I said, oh, like, well, how would you describe it? And he said, oh, it was, um, uh, it was sort of like a Jim Jarmusch movie. And Jim Jarmusch is one of my, like, most, like, I met him in a bar in New York when I was 23 years old when he had made Stranger Than Paradise. And I was like, oh, my God. And I had great fortune to make three movies with him.

[00:38:43] And I said, oh, what's it like? And he was describing it. And I said, oh, yeah, why, what, what, what's it called? And he goes, oh, Napoleon Dynamite. And I was like, what? Right? And, uh, and I was like, is it good? And you're like, we're sending people to see it right now. And I was like, if it's really good, we're in trouble. I said, what did the audience think? And they said, the audience loved it. Right? And I'm like, uh-oh, trouble. And so I, so I called the person selling the, the, uh, the film.

[00:39:13] And, and, uh, I said, look, man, I'm going to New York. But, you know, do not sell it. You've got to let us see it. Do not sell it. Right? And he's like, nah, you know, I don't know. We're pretty close. Right? And I was like, there's not a screening right now. So I called the person that I trusted the most in terms of evaluating, uh, films. And I, I said, I called her up and said, Amy, you know, you've got to go see this. And she goes, well, like, you know, I'm doing something else. I was like, Amy, you've got to go see Napoleon Dynamite.

[00:39:40] And so I'm in the car to Salt Lake and, and I'm driving back because I had to get back to, uh, something, uh, a school event for my son. And, uh, like after an hour, the phone rings and it's Amy and she goes, buy it. And, uh, and I said, well, you didn't see the whole movie. It's not over. She goes, buy it. Just buy it. Right? She's like, you don't have to see it. Just buy it. So I called the sales agent while I was in the car and I was like, okay, what do you want? He goes, too late.

[00:40:08] And, uh, um, uh, and so that's, you know, and, you know, the film went on, when the film went on to do great, you know, it was a big success. It's a great part of the Sundance history as is Motorcycle Diaries. And that's the kind of thing that happens, right? And it's exciting and it's fun and you hear about it. And, uh, and so that's one example of, you know, yeah. I was disappointed. I lost the movie. Right. And I can be a pretty competitive person, but I was really happy for the movie.

[00:40:38] Yeah. You, you often remember the ones that got away or the ones that didn't go right. Not, not the things that just fell into place. You know, that's, uh, no, and we got Motorcycle Diaries, right? And, uh, and, and it was a great, it's a beautiful, beautiful movie. So great. So we're going to have time for a few more questions. So as you're ready, Oh, come on up. There you go. Wrote my question down. Well, introduce yourself first. Oh, hi, I'm Christer. And Christer's new to Boulder. Yes.

[00:41:08] Uh, so one of our local challenges is that many of the young artists who built the very Boulder vibe that brought Sundance here can't afford to live in our city limits anymore. Sorry. A little emotional because I know some of those people who struggle to make ends meet. Um, so what's Sundance doing to grow the international audience so that Boulder gets high value tourists who are unlikely to bid up our local property values? While you're thinking of your answer, I'd like to apologize to the real estate agents here at 8Z

[00:41:38] who would love to see our property values go up. Well, I probably said this earlier. The reason I took the job is because I believe that Sundance is not only singular and individual, but I believe it's one of the most culture, most important cultural institutions in this country. And, um, and I don't believe it, I know it. Right? And, uh, the Sundance Institute and the festival and everything.

[00:42:06] Um, and one of the things is that we have in the past had what we call satellite festivals around the world and things like that. Um, but I actually think that we support the international filmmaking community in ways that people don't realize. So, of the 600 people who go through our programs every year, about 100 of them come from overseas. Um, Latin America, Europe, Asia, right?

[00:42:35] Um, of Eugene Stepped Out, but of the 150 movies, I think probably 20-ish of them will be from overseas. Um, and having their world premieres here. So, we'll be bringing artists in from overseas, right? Who, um, had a really interesting meeting yesterday at your, um, at the forum about, um, uh, where there's a young artist from, from Boulder.

[00:43:02] And he was talking about how, you know, how could he interact with people from overseas, right? And I thought it was a really good question. And, and I think that, you know, probably integrating the international artists, uh, with artists here, um, so that they can, um, have conversations that they might not otherwise be able to have.

[00:43:21] But in answer to your question, um, we are actively working to encourage, um, you know, the big media companies in Europe. You know, it's, one of the things about the American entertainment industry is people forget that it's not just us, right? And, for instance, in Europe, there are seven big European studios. So, a couple things.

[00:43:49] I went to Cannes, uh, the Cannes Film Festival in May, and we created a great deck. And I met with the seven big European studios. Um, and just sort of began to socialize and educate them about everything that we do. Um, you know, I want them to support the, the artist programs. I want them to make sure that, that, you know, interesting filmmakers are applying to the artist programs. Um, I want them to know about Colab, right? I want them to support Colab.

[00:44:17] I'd like to be able to have Colab not just in English, right? Um, I'd like to attract funders from, uh, Europe for Catalyst and things like that. Um, and I want to attract, uh, the European distribution company back to, um, uh, to Boulder. It had become increasingly difficult, um, for them because of, uh, because of expense and just simple logistics of, uh, travel and things like that.

[00:44:44] Um, there are now 30 direct flights into Denver from overseas. Um, a couple of days ago, um, United announced that they're, they're opening a flight from Paris. Starting in January, uh, I think it's May of 27. I'm going to try to convince, yeah, I'm trying to get them to move it up. But, but it's really, you know, I, I think because we're so singular and because we have such a focus on emerging artists,

[00:45:14] right, that it's not necessarily replicated overseas. And then the other area that, that I'm really, really interested in is, um, Sundance is a nonprofit, right? And 501c3. And, um, there are, you know, there's a very, very, um, sophisticated film funding kind of, um, history in Europe especially,

[00:45:39] where a very, very large amount of, uh, the funding of films comes from state subsidies. Right? And it's a very intricate system. And, um, as a nonprofit, I think that there are ways that we can actually, and they would love to be more involved. They would love to have more American films come, be made in Europe. And they would love to have more European films made in America. Right?

[00:46:07] But because that money is largely state subsidies, it's difficult for them to marry with commercial American enterprises. Right? We're a nonprofit. Right? So I'm, this may be a total pipe dream. And, you know, as you get to know me, you'll realize that 50, 50% of my ideas are okay. And 50% of them are unbelievably stupid. Um, uh, but, but I believe in... Not usually. Um, uh, but I believe in conversation, right?

[00:46:35] And I believe in ideas, and I believe in sort of throwing stuff out and seeing if it, if it, if it fits. So I think there may also be an area where we can attract those funders into, into... So I think there's a whole balance of people that we can attract to, to Boulder. And there's two ways that we can make it more affordable for artists. Uh, it's, there's, uh, two sides to the ledger. One is make more affordable in the context of it costing less to be here.

[00:47:04] That's harder to do. But the other way is give more opportunities to make more money here. And, uh, I think that's where this community can really come together. We've had huge step up in support for Tulagi this year from the donor community, mostly of Boulder and kind of adjacent areas to Boulder. Most of the funding for Tulagi, the nonprofit, is coming from a relatively small number of people who are writing big checks. Uh, and that's gonna put a lot of artists to work.

[00:47:33] And I think between Sundance, between Tulagi and all the months in between, activating those, uh, those, uh, you know, donors to kind of lean into the art community and the artists themselves. Create more, uh, events throughout the year, uh, that will give people a chance to produce their art. To, uh, display and showcase their art is gonna be huge.

[00:47:58] And I think one thing we talked about earlier, how do you bring the, uh, the CU Boulder community into it? Because if we get the CU Boulder community starting to lean more into attending and being part of events, creating more energy at night in, you know, the greater Pearl Street area, that's gonna put more and more opportunities for artists, uh, to have work that pays them.

[00:48:21] So I think we gotta be as dedicated to creating opportunities for the artists, uh, as we are on how to, you know, work on the affordability side. Because affordability, there's, you know, in an area like Boulder, there's only so much you're gonna be able to do to make, you know, make it less expensive to live here. The good news is, relative to some other geographies, you know, in California, you know, if you're talking about L.A., you're talking about San Francisco, you have to go a long ways from the center core to find affordability.

[00:48:50] Here, you can find affordability 15 minutes away, 20 minutes away. Yeah, which is a very different dynamic. But, you know, let's give a lot of reason for them to, to be able to, you know, to showcase their films, showcase their, their music, showcase their other art, uh, throughout the year. And use Sundance, use Tawagi to bring more and more, uh, travel into Boulder that supports the venues and supports the artists.

[00:49:18] Well, that's one of the reasons we're here, right? Is, is specifically because, you know, we see the opportunity for more and more, um, our capacity of, in terms of just actual seats, um, is going to increase by 34% and moving from Utah to here. Oh, wow, I didn't, I had not heard that. Um, uh, it creates a, not to mention all the students, not just at CU, but at, um, CSU, right? Yeah. University of Denver. Mines. You know, mines all over the place.

[00:49:46] You know, we, we, we, we're involved in a real audience development. Um, um, you know, I'm going to repeat myself. This festival is for the audience and the filmmakers, right? That's who it's for. But I also think, you know, and, and maybe I'm going too far afield, right? You know, I, I always try to, you know, I like to say that artists like to, you know, one of the beauties of, of, of, of artists,

[00:50:11] whether they're musicians or, or painters or filmmakers is that they see around the corner, around the most pressing issues of our, of our time, right? And they're going to start talking about what's most important, uh, before probably we are, right? And I think the same thing that Colorado can take advantage of that, right? They can take advantage of who's here and the resources that are here, the environment that, that y'all live in, and things like that, and really build a Colorado film community.

[00:50:41] Um, uh, it's not easy. It's not easy. But, but, you know, you've, if you take a look at the change that is happening, you know, how do you, how do you take advantage of that change, right? How do you incorporate it into your community in a way that can support artists and do it, you know, look, it's a, it's an uncared block, right? And there are a whole lot of people in the industry who are sort of, for very real and good reasons, tied to a certain way of operating, right?

[00:51:11] And right now we're getting to a place where we have to think outside of the box, right? And we have to think about doing things differently. And I think that's a great opportunity. You know, one thing that we haven't talked much about is you. Uh, we talked a little bit about why you were interested in Sundance. You touched a little bit on your background, but let's spend a little bit more time hearing about your story. And why did Sundance, when they were searching for a new CEO, a lot of people would have loved that job. Why'd they pick you?

[00:51:43] Why'd they pick me? Um, uh, uh, well, I'll start at the beginning, right? I'm not going to tell you my whole history. But, but I have a very, very, uh, just, I mean, a movie called Arrival in, uh, 2015. Um, and it's, uh, it's based upon a short story called Story of Your Life. And if anybody's seen it, it's, it stars Amy Adams, direct, directed by Denis Villeneuve. Um, uh, um, it's a wonderful movie. I'm very proud of it, actually.

[00:52:10] And, um, but it's all about, at its heart, it's about communication, right? And the story is about a woman who's a linguist played by Amy Adams, who is trying to figure out, uh, how to communicate to a group of aliens who have landed on Earth. And figure out why they're here at a, at a moment of increasing, increasing danger as people begin to get, uh, scared that they're here to, to essentially attack, right?

[00:52:38] And it creates, that, that fear creates a lot of division amongst countries around the world. And nobody can communicate with them. And she's brought in to communicate with them. Or to figure out how to do it. And they communicate in a written language. Where the language is, is, is drawn in circles. Um, um, and when I was reading the story and I was looking at it, I was like, oh, that's my life. Right? So that's my professional life.

[00:53:08] My professional life I really see is a series of, of concentric circles that sort of all add up into a bigger one. Which is I start at one place. And I do a lot of mentoring of, of, of college students and things like that. Is that it sort of starts in one place. And, you know, over the course of the time that I work at a, at a job, I learn something. I learn things, right? And, and then I get to the end of the circle and I go to the next one. And I'm, I, I really focus in on applying what I've learned from step by step by step.

[00:53:37] I don't like to repeat myself. Um, uh, and I see myself in, is like these, these circles of like, oh, what did I learn in that job that applies to this job? First job I ever had in the film business was collecting for Paramount Pictures from theaters that owed us under $500. Right? And, uh, um, it was the only job I could get. Right? And people, and it was really a sales job. Like, you know, please pay us. Right?

[00:54:05] Um, uh, and, uh, people always say to me like, well, where, how'd you learn how to sell? Well, I learned to sell because I was a paper boy. Right? When I was nine years old. And that's how I learned how to sell. And I learned how to communicate with people. But anyway, in my circle of the story of, of my life, um, the last job I had was working for a company called Participant. And, um, Participant was a dual mission company.

[00:54:30] We were there to make what we thought, you know, were, were important films that, that talked about important issues that would also entertain people. So, you know, Spotlight, Green Book, Roma, Inconvenient Truth, those are all Participant movies. Um, but I learned something from that job. Right? In my circle. And what I learned was that, um, and we, we used to call it the, uh, fourth act. Right?

[00:54:57] That film does something to people that other art forms don't do, which it gives the audience the opportunity to take what they've experienced and do something with it. And there are multiple, and which is what sort of Participant was all about. And we called it the fourth act. Right? And we were privately funded and things like that. The company existed for about 22 years.

[00:55:20] And the decision was made, ultimately, after many, many months of discussion, uh, that the company was going to be sunsetted. So we did that. Um, uh, and, um, I thought I was going to just move back to New York after 18 years in L.A. My wife took a job and then running a non-profit there. And I thought I was just going to sort of enjoy my life for the first time in 40 years. And I was advising people and things like that.

[00:55:48] That everything that I had learned throughout my career about running organizations, about, about, um, uh, how do you reach audiences, how to build things, and stuff like that, was, was more meaningful than anything I had ever done. Right? Right? It was my opportunity to close this Participant Circle and move on to another one. And that's why I took the job. Right? And, uh, I was, you know, I was really fortunate that they offered it to me.

[00:56:17] I think the reason that they offered it to me is because I've been doing this for a long time. I have a real, a real belief in what they do. And I also believe in growing. And I believe in building. And I think it's a great opportunity to build the next phase. And by the way, we're going to do it with you. Quite honestly, we are. Yeah. Well, thank you so much on behalf.

[00:56:46] I think I could speak on behalf of Boulder, on behalf of Colorado, at least the many, many, many dozens of people who've made this comment to me. And that is one of gratitude for Sundance choosing to be here in Boulder, to be thinking about this as a Colorado opportunity and to caring so much about this community that we call home. And I think you guys are going to begin to call home as well.

[00:57:09] And thank you for joining us on the Bear Roars, being part of the Talagi and the collaboration where I think we could all work together to make not just our community a better community, but our community at large, the world community, a better place to bring people together. Thank you. Thank you, David. Thank you. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Bear Roars.

[00:57:34] Check out Stretch, the new song from Dan Caruso with music by Jason Mendelsohn, available now on all streaming services. If you enjoyed the episode, please like and subscribe on your listening platform. This podcast was produced by Loud Bear Productions and edited by Hannah Schmetzer with support from Kendall Weinberg, Alex Kim and Gibson Siegert.